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Negative dependency between jobs in mainframe


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Sree Sandhya Kota

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 14, 2021 8:22 pm
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Hi ..I have a scenario to place a negative dependency between 2 jobs.
it means if one job A executes , other job B should not execute.
This should be done without a scheduler.Can any one pls suggest on this.
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Rohit Umarjikar

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 14, 2021 8:53 pm
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Not possible as per me. Why not use scheduler?
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Robert Sample

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 14, 2021 9:03 pm
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Without a scheduler, the only way to do this is to determine which job to execute manually and submit it.
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Joerg.Findeisen

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 14, 2021 9:07 pm
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Consider using Jobgroups or, very simple, same jobnames.
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Rohit Umarjikar

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 15, 2021 7:00 am
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Joerg.Findeisen wrote:
Consider using Jobgroups or, very simple, same jobnames.
how could same job name can be placed in one prod jcl Lib? Usually the member name is same as job name.
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sergeyken
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 15, 2021 5:02 pm
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Rohit Umarjikar wrote:
Joerg.Findeisen wrote:
Consider using Jobgroups or, very simple, same jobnames.
how could same job name can be placed in one prod jcl Lib? Usually the member name is same as job name.

1) “Usually” doesn’t mean “must be”.
2) One member can include as many JOB statements as needed.
3) There is no need to use a PDS to store a JCL stream. Any PS dataset is acceptable. Even a deck of punchcards was being successfully used for this purpose in ancient times.
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Rohit Umarjikar

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 15, 2021 7:29 pm
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sergeyken wrote:
Rohit Umarjikar wrote:
Joerg.Findeisen wrote:
Consider using Jobgroups or, very simple, same jobnames.
how could same job name can be placed in one prod jcl Lib? Usually the member name is same as job name.

1) “Usually” doesn’t mean “must be”.
2) One member can include as many JOB statements as needed.
3) There is no need to use a PDS to store a JCL stream. Any PS dataset is acceptable. Even a deck of punchcards was being successfully used for this purpose in ancient times.

It’s unrealistic and I have never seen this is true when I worked for big firms so far. So you might have worked where that is possible as lack of missing scheduling or version control tools e.t.c. If one is using scheduling and version control tool it is not possible to have two jobs with same member name. One member having multiple jobs cards is possible but that’s not the ask here.
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sergeyken
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 15, 2021 7:45 pm
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Rohit Umarjikar wrote:
sergeyken wrote:
Rohit Umarjikar wrote:
Joerg.Findeisen wrote:
Consider using Jobgroups or, very simple, same jobnames.
how could same job name can be placed in one prod jcl Lib? Usually the member name is same as job name.

1) “Usually” doesn’t mean “must be”.
2) One member can include as many JOB statements as needed.
3) There is no need to use a PDS to store a JCL stream. Any PS dataset is acceptable. Even a deck of punchcards was being successfully used for this purpose in ancient times.

It’s unrealistic and I have never seen this is true when I worked for big firms so far. So you might have worked where that is possible as lack of missing scheduling or version control tools e.t.c. If one is using scheduling and version control tool it is not possible to have two jobs with same member name. One member having multiple jobs cards is possible but that’s not the ask here.

It is absolutely realistic.
I participated in a project for one of the largest US organizations, where hundreds to thousands of daily jobs, later scheduled and controlled by CONTROL-M facility, are initially generated and customized by means of FTS as several huge job streams, with hundreds of related jobs in each of them.
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Rohit Umarjikar

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 15, 2021 8:13 pm
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Exactly , in today world almost everyone uses scheduling and version control tools , what’s done in past or ancient is not something I want to argue on.

So let it get clarity why not scheduling an option here first else as said by Robert submit them manually one after another.
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sergeyken
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 15, 2021 8:31 pm
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Rohit Umarjikar wrote:
what’s done in past or ancient is not something I want to argue on.

About 80-90% of the total permanently running software nowadays is the “ancient one”, created between 1960-1980; it doesn’t require daily patches, and fixes, unlike the “modern” development which will need every-hour, and every-minute fixes very soon.
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Phrzby Phil

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Joined: 31 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 16, 2021 8:04 am
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Quote:
Even a deck of punchcards was being successfully used for this purpose in ancient times.


One danger here: In one of the original Mission Impossible TV episodes (1966-73), the Peter Graves character is to disrupt a computer center operation.

He gets on a tour of the computer room, and as the tour group passes a card reader with about a foot or two of cards on the input stack, he slips a punchcard into the pile.

As the group continues around the room, the camera periodically shows the card stack getting lower and lower, and when the fatal card is read in, all of a sudden the tape drives go berserk, and the card punch starts spewing cards out all over the floor.

Never mind there are brackets on the cardpunch that prevent this and which cannot be moved by a program, and never mind about a dozen other things.

Pretty funny.
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jasorn
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 17, 2021 7:57 pm
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We do this all of the time and there are various ways to do this. I'd need to know more about your use case but things to know/investigate that might help you are that jobs can be submitted from job, you can make use of datasets to indicate if jobs have run, and you can build your own schedule making uses of files or tables to keep track of what has already run and what to run next.

I've worked in various shops where for whatever reason we would not allowed to use the 'proper' schedule to schedule test jobs. Or, if we were allowed, the process to update the test schedule using the proper scheduler was too onerous.

So I've used the above techniques in various combinations to run test schedules many times.
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jasorn
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 17, 2021 8:00 pm
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We do this all of the time and there are various ways to do this. I'd need to know more about your use case but things to know/investigate that might help you are that jobs can be submitted from job, you can make use of datasets to indicate if jobs have run, and you can build your own schedule making uses of files or tables to keep track of what has already run and what to run next.

I've worked in various shops where for whatever reason we would not allowed to use the 'proper' schedule to schedule test jobs. Or, if we were allowed, the process to update the test schedule using the proper scheduler was too onerous.

So I've used the above techniques in various combinations to run test schedules many times.
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