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IMS Database merge
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adutta24

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 03, 2009 5:05 pm    Post subject: IMS Database merge
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Hi All,

I have a requirement wherein an application which is present in two services of mainframe, is required to be merged into one service. The application is in IMS database.

My main concern is wheteher I can unload the databases from both places, merge them and then upload into one database or not. And if yes then how?

Also what happens to the child segments of that database which are linked to other databases of the application. How do I take care of such scenarios.

Please help.
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Sandy Zimmer

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 03, 2009 8:38 pm    Post subject:
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I have a requirement wherein an application which is present in two services of mainframe, is required to be merged into one service. The application is in IMS database.

Sorry for the confusion, but do you have 2 separate IMS databases? If so, you need to tell us the objective. Are you trying to accomplish what you accomplish in a DB2 join? Remember that IMS is not DB2. If you could present the requirement, we could help.
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Anuj Dhawan

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 1:48 pm    Post subject:
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This question is asked in other forum also, don't you get enough there, to work with?
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adutta24

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 3:06 pm    Post subject:
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Hi All,

I mean that I have an application which is present in two mainframes. Now I need to bring that to 1 mainframe and have the full application at one place. When having in two mainframes, I used to maintain two databases for the same application.

Like I have say 1000 stores all employees data. I have 500 stores data in one mainframe and 500 in another.

Now I need to merge these two data into one database of IMS. How to do this.

Please note that currently we maintain two IMS databases for the application in two separate mainframes.
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Anuj Dhawan

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 3:19 pm    Post subject:
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Quote:
I have an application which is present in two mainframes
This is an over ambitious sentence -- 'two mainframes" just for a single application...I'm confused (and I hope you understand what you are talking about).

Again, I believe, there are 3 databases involved here, let's say they are old1, old2 and new1. old1 and old2 are of same (similar?) structure and you want to combine these two into new1?
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adutta24

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 3:36 pm    Post subject:
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I have IMS databases T1 (present in 1st mainframe) and T2 (present in 2nd mainframe) for the same application, and I need to get one database T1 (in 1 mainframe) after merging T1 and T2
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Sandy Zimmer

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 4:51 pm    Post subject:
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I too question 2 mainframes?

Unless you are involved in a merger or acquisition?

When having in two mainframes, I used to maintain two databases for the same application.

Multiple databases for the same application is common. Multiple mainframes are not.
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adutta24

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 6:55 pm    Post subject:
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For our client we have two mainframes, where in each mainframe we maintain the application separately for half of the data.

This was done so that the application does not slow down.

Now we need to merge the application and put it as one application in one mainframe.

The application has multiple databases.

We need to merge the same databases present in two mainframes.

My main query was how to merge same databases data in IMS
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Sandy Zimmer

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 10:14 pm    Post subject:
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Your DBA group probably runs unloads for backups for each database. These backups could be merged for each corresponding database into one load file.
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adutta24

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 05, 2009 2:02 am    Post subject: Reply to: IMS Database merge
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yeah we have unload jobs, but will this merge be simple merge and do you have any details so that I can read and understand the o/p of the unload job. like the header and trailer records.

For Unload I am using DFSURGU0.
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dick scherrer

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 05, 2009 2:51 am    Post subject:
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Hello,

How much research has gone into combining these 2 systems? If this is like several i've been involved with, the "merging" of the data will not be so difficult, but the logistics of the execution of the application may present some "opportunities".

Quote:
but will this merge be simple merge
Maybe, but i've never been so lucky. . .

Something that happens quite often is the same value in a table means one thing to the "A" users, but something else to the "B" users. What about the "Customer" table? If the same customer is "in" both systems, which one is "right" for the combined system? There are possibly many situations like these 2 that need to be identified and handled before proceeding. . .
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adutta24

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 09, 2009 12:10 am    Post subject:
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Thanks for your sugestions..

We are looking into this very seriously now.

But will the merge be a simple merge of the two databases. Because there seems to be header and trailer in the formated output of unload. Do you have any details to read the formated o/p of the IMS unload.
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Sandy Zimmer

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 09, 2009 1:39 am    Post subject:
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Do you ever talk to IBM? They should be able to help you.

Quote:
We are looking into this very seriously now.


Having 2 mainframes is a very SERIOUS situation. I do not know of ANY installations that would spend that much money. There HAD to be a better solution.
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dick scherrer

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 09, 2009 2:11 am    Post subject:
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Hello,

To repeat - i believe the actual merging of the data will be rather straightforward.

Determining what needs to be "done" may be problematic. . .

You may want to consider using something other than unload to create the sequential files that will eventually be "merged". Then there will be no concern about the generated header/trailer data.
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Sandy Zimmer

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 09, 2009 2:20 am    Post subject:
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Just to be clear - you are obviously a retail organization. I have never-ever heard of a retail organization NEEDING 2 mainframes. Who would ever approve such an expense?

Quote:
Like I have say 1000 stores all employees data. I have 500 stores data in one mainframe and 500 in another.

Now I need to merge these two data into one database of IMS. How to do this.


This "problem" is small for IMS. You really - really need some outside expertise aside from posting your "problem" in this forum.
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dbzTHEdinosauer

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 09, 2009 3:17 am    Post subject:
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Sandy,

this could be the outcome of merger.
In which case,
these guys are trying to stuff the files of the 'bought store' with the buyer.

and as usual, the same idiot mentality that converts vsam direct to db2,
some jerkoff figured, merge the IMS database.

normally there is a inhouse group that handles these 'conversions',
as the only problem would be the proper mapping of the newly acquired to he existing system.

as the location of the TS is london,
it appears that the idiots that decided to get rid of all the 'expensive' existing
inhouse people and replace them with cheap imports (banks in england and the US did this also) they are now paying the price...hah hah!!
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Sandy Zimmer

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 09, 2009 3:34 am    Post subject:
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I have been involved in multiple "mergers" -- "acquistions" - whatever. Usually, there is a PLAN - and in most instances, the data is not formatted equally. This seems to me to be a "misunderstanding" of what constitutes a "mainframe". In the world of client servers, it would be a server. As I said previously, I cannot ever imagine someone besides a HUGE installation - like the gov - spending soooooo much money simply because someone cannot figure out how to make it work.
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dick scherrer

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 09, 2009 4:01 am    Post subject:
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Hello,

Quote:
I cannot ever imagine someone besides a HUGE installation
Yup, and there are many more than make the news or trade press icon_smile.gif
Quote:
simply because someone cannot figure out how to make it work.
There wasn't a "simply" - it was a matter of sheer volume or the applications were used by "competing" divisions and the corporate direction was the data be physically in different data centers.
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Sandy Zimmer

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 09, 2009 5:02 am    Post subject:
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OK - alrighty then - why would someone with such huge resources come here for advice? 2 mainframes?
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dick scherrer

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 09, 2009 8:10 pm    Post subject: Reply to: IMS Database merge
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Hi Sandy,

Maybe because they "inherited" this when they won the contract?

d
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